I remember when I was about 5 and a half, when my brother was 2 or 3 years old at the time, his birthday’s December the 8th… At that time there was a chimpanzee on television – he was on the Ed Sullivan show and all these little guest shows – His name was Zippy – He wore a yellow t-shirt with the word ‘Zip, in red, across it and somehow they managed to get him to wear a pair of white sneakers and he was popular, all over the place, and was the most popular toy, that year, for Christmas. My brother just adored Zippy and he wanted Zippy. My mom said that I could get Zippy for him, using the little bit of money that I earned during the year for emptying the trash, I didn’t really get an allowance but my mother gave me a dime here or a nickel here and all that stuff. And, so the story goes that she told me I didn’t have enough to buy Zippy but she slipped the rest to the lady and I bought Zippy for my brother.

Well, Daniel went bananas over Zippy. He dragged that monkey all over the place. It was a black monkey and the face and the hands and the ears were made of a soft rubber.  I don’t know how many times my mother sewed it! The black mat that was the body of it and it was falling apart because he played with the thing constantly.

On Christmas morning, when he opened that up he hugged that Zippy and he didn’t want to open anything else up. He would dance with that monkey, standing him on the floor, his early association with music goes back to that point, my whole family really. My dad had a saxophone and he used to play occasionally and he had bought a piano for my mother and he used to play that, cursing because he always missed chords.

I think the thing that came out the most was that, up to that point, I really looked forward to Christmas for all the goodies I was going to get, I had a list a mile and a half long and we used to go and see Santa Claus – Daniel also loved Christmas, it was such a special time for him, he looked forward to it, he was an upbeat kid all along, but he would really get upbeat during Christmas.

Up until the time I went in to the Service, or he went off to Edgar Winter, the way that he loved Christmas was not because of all the Christmas stuff he was going to get .

We used to take the bus downtown about 3 to 4 weeks before Christmas and we’d go to the stores and everything – as soon as we got off the bus I wanted to head off to the stores because there were several Santa Clauses’ in different stores and my thought was, if I hit all those separate Santa Clauses’ and give them my whole list I’d probably hit the right Santa Claus! Because I knew he couldn’t be in the same place all the time! My brother didn’t really want to go into the stores, he would just look at all the Christmas lights and all the stuff in the stores. Pomeroy’s were on the corner of 4th and Market and they used to do their windows up – they had all kind of animated things there – they put a lot of money into it. They don’t do it anymore, nobody does, but that’s what my brother wanted to see. I’d be freezing my butt off and he’s want to see all these lights and all the decorations in the store windows. When we’d do the tree and be putting all the lights up and Christmas decorations, he’d put a decoration on the tree and then sit there and admire it.

What I learned was that seeing him, so unbelievably happy, with that Zippy, that changed me. Up until that point I wanted everything, and, ever since that time, I realised, looking back on it, down through the years too, I got much more joy out of surprising someone else with something I’d bought them, I would sneak around and wrap them up with nobody seeing and I just loved that. It came from my brother, from him being so unbelievably happy with that monkey. He taught me a lesson without even knowing it.

Many thanks to David Hartman.

Many thanks to Glenn Ellison for making this article possible.

How and when did you both meet?

It was early January 1984 at 30,000 feet flying from New York to LA. I was returning from a business trip and job interview to my home in LA. Dan was going to finish up work on “I Can Dream About You”.

How did you wind up in Westport at Multilevel?

Dan and I had a lot in common and became close friends. Two months later I got the job I had interviewed for, in December, and Dan asked me to live in his house until I found a place of my own. I was in and out of Westport for the next 10 years. I bought a small Coop in the Village in 1985.

Did you get to experience any of Dan’s recording sessions?

Oh, absolutely – I was there for many of them, the only non-musician in the group! I provided hand-claps.

Is that when you first met Charlie Midnight?

Yes, Charlie Midnight is a great guy and huge talent. He was the perfect compliment to Dan’s music and they worked extremely well together.

Have you a favourite composition?

Gosh – There are so many, some of which were on the “Whiteboy” project that has never been released. “Circle of Light” comes to mind as a brilliant and moving track. I have a tape of the whole project and it was some of their best work. Dan’s music was always evolving and Charlie was right there with him.

Who were some of the artists you met while working with Dan?

Neil Sedaka, Paul King, Alison Moyet, Nona Hendryx, Janis Ian, James Brown, Mavis Staples.

How would you describe the private Dan?

Dan was the genuine article, full of passion and joy for just living. He was never a celebrity to his close friends, and was always charming and giving to his fans. He definitely has a spiritual side, that wasn’t so religious , as it was about the soul, and how to make the most out of the time we have on earth. He was kind and gentle to a fault.

Do you remember the first time you saw him perform?

Oh yes, and what a shock. I had only known him a couple of months when we went to a dance club in the Village. He was going to try out a couple of new songs there. Jellybean Benitez was in the DJ booth with his girlfriend Madonna who had just had her first hit with Holiday. Dan jumped on stage and performed “We Are The Young” and “I Can Dream About You”. He was incredible and the crowd loved it. With all those dance hits in his past, man could he move, as well as sing!

Are there any special memories you would like to share?

Hundreds. Maybe we’ll save some for another chat. The two that really stick out in my mind were the fun of touring Europe with him when “I Can Dream About You” was climbing the charts. I saw him sing it many times and the crowds responded by wanting to sing and dance with him. When you hear the song today there is the same response. It is an all time pop masterpiece.

The second memory occurred ten years later, 1993. Dan had a difficult year, health wise, in and out of hospital. I had been back in California for about three years by this time so I couldn’t see him as often as I’d like. As fate would have it, in December, I was out of a job so I flew back and spent the entire month at his newly remodeled home. We had the greatest time of our 10 year friendship. He rallied and seemed to be making a full recovery. We turned the house into a Christmas fantasy, saw all the holiday shows in Manhattan and laughed 24/7. When I flew back to LA on New Year’s Day I thought he would live forever. Glenn, thank you for your insights and the great photos and video clips you sent us.

It is my great pleasure to help in anyway I can. I have many memories of this great man. Dan would be so moved to think that this website was created and maintained by fans who never even met him – just as I am.

Thank you.

June 2006

Many thanks to Glenn Ellison for his kind co-operation with this article.

When did you first meet Dan Hartman and how did your collaboration come about?

I was introduced to Dan in 1983. A mutual friend of ours, Debbie DiCesare, had sent him my album (Charlie Midnight/Innocent Bystander, Columbia Records, 1982) to listen to because Dan was looking for a collaborator. Dan apparently liked the album, particularly my lyrics, and called me to set up a meeting.

Our conversation on the phone established an easy connection between us and we met at a coffee shop in New York City on 57th St. and 7th Avenue. We exchanged some ideas, I took some notes and our partnership began. Soon thereafter Dan asked if I was interested in establishing a writing partnership with him. That was the beginning of the most creatively satisfying period of my career as well as a deep friendship.

Could you tell us about some of your experiences in working with him?

Dan had the best "ears" of anyone who I have encountered. He heard glitches and sour pitches that in the studio, at times, nobody else could hear. In the days before digital pitch correction this meant having to record things until they were "right." With Dan's ears being the arbiter of "right" and "wrong" this often meant intense, arduous sessions. He never settled for anything less than what he believed was "right."

He was very specific about how he wanted his mixes to sound. We were mixing a song at Unique Studios with Chris Lord-Alge. I arrived before Dan. Chris played the mix then turned to me and said, "it sucks." I was taken aback and before I could reply Chris continued (and I am paraphrasing). "Why should I bust my chops," he said, "Hartman's going to change everything anyway."

Chris said this with total respect. He admired Dan's talent and "ears" and was correct in not going too far with the mix before Dan arrived. Dan also respected and admired Chris' talents and together they made a great team. Dan understood all the technical aspects of shaping sound and would often describe what he wanted in specific technical terms that left little room for interpretation.

In the early stages of our partnership Dan was contacted by the music supervisor for a film called "Breakin'". He wanted Dan to write a song for the main dance sequence. Break dancing and the music that accompanied it were about to become popular and this film was the first to try and take advantage of its burgeoning popularity. Dan was wary of doing it because it was a fairly low budget film and he questioned its chances for success. I, however, was anxious to do it for the synchronization fee. It was almost noon and Dan said, "if you have a lyric by 5 today, I'll write the music." I completed a lyric before 5 for "We Are The Young," and the music supervisor loved it. The dance sequence was cut to the song with Dan as the artist and everyone was happy. Then Jimmy Iovine, who was producing Dan's solo album, heard the song and wanted it for Dan's album as the first single. Dan withdrew the song amidst much furor. The dance number had already been cut to the song and withdrawing it was a big problem. As a result, we wrote another song called "Heart Of The Beat." Dan did not want to be the artist on this song and so we created a faux group called '3V' which was, in fact, Dan and me. The film was a success and the album was even more successful, selling over 3 million copies. '3V" was asked to perform at a Spring Break concert on the beach in Florida. It was a blast. In the end, "Heart Of the Beat," was not used as the main song but instead a song sung by Ollie and Jerry called "There's No Stoppin' Us" replaced "We Are The Young," and, powered by the momentum of the film, hit the top of the charts. "We Are The Young" peaked at Number 25.

I loved to watch Dan in the studio. He was a virtuoso multi-instrumentalist as well as being an ace engineer. Often, at his home studio in Westport, Connecticut, he would engineer his own guitar overdubs, standing in front of his MCI console with a guitar in his hand. He would roll the tape, wait for the appropriate moment and then hit the 'record' button. A split second after slamming the button he would attack his guitar with precision and intensity. When finished with the part, he would, with a lightning fast finger, hit the button once again. I was always amazed and entertained.

When we were in the studio recording James Brown's vocal for "Living In America," Dan wanted him to end the song with a hearty "I feel good." Dan and I had a discussion about whether or not it was appropriate to try and direct a James Brown performance. With some trepidation Dan made the request and with complete class and understanding, Mr. Brown obliged. One take and we had a classic James Brown moment.

What sort of things did you have in common with Dan?

Dan and I both came from no-frills, working class backgrounds. We shared a love for: Woody Allen films, Motown, soulful singers, accomplished musicians, song writing and great Pop hooks.

You and Dan did a good deal of collaborating on many songs. Could you tell us about how that process actually worked?

Dan always liked to have a lyric before he wrote a melody and created a track. He reasoned that he needed to know the essence of the song in order to inspire his creative process. As a result, we would discuss an idea and I would then write lyrics. Often, I would throw out some lines or titles before proceeding to ensure that Dan agreed on the direction. If he concurred then I would go on to complete a lyric. Dan was very tough and uncensored in his assessments but our dynamics allowed for this. Being satisfied with the final work was all that mattered. However, because of his unvarnished critiques, I developed a system wherein I would write many alternative lyrics so that Dan could have choices.

Is it true that Dan threatened to pull a song from Rocky because you weren't invited to the premiere?

Because Dan was the producer of "Living In America" and the better-known partner of our writing team, he was invited to the premiere of Rocky IV while I was not. Before I was even able to express any dissatisfaction, Dan became enraged and threatened to pull the song from the film. This was not an atypical action for Dan. He was fearless in following his convictions and sense of right and wrong. He also valued our relationship and friendship more than he feared ruffling some feathers. I went to the premiere.

Could you tell us about the making of the "I Can Dream About You" ?

Working with Dan on the "I Can Dream About You" album was a privilege and a great learning experience. Having previously been a recording artist who wrote songs only for my own use and from my own experience, the process of writing for Dan was a crash course in collaboration. He wanted to create a work that had depth as well as accessibility. We wrote many more songs than finally appeared on the album. Dan took some risks on quite a few of those songs that, because of the edginess of the music and lyrics, were ultimately rejected by the record company. He involved me in all phases of the production and because of that experience I was able to make the transition into record production. In essence, I went to school during making of the "I Can Dream About You" album.

Did you work with Dan at "Multi-Level" and if so, could you tell us about that?

Dan's studio, Multi-Level was where we did most of our work. It was very idyllic in its setting and atmosphere. The studio was on the top level of his home in Westport, Connecticut and a river ran behind the house. When the weather allowed, Dan recorded with the windows and doors open, allowing the fresh country air and the scents of the local flora into the session. He was always a gracious host. For me, who grew up in Brooklyn and was at the time living in a small apartment in Manhattan, it was like having a rustic retreat, albeit one in the ritzy locale of Westport, Connecticut.

The "White Boy" album - could you tell us about the making of it – and also could you share with us why it was never released?

The "White Boy" album was a result of Dan's continuing desire to create an edgier recording that would signify an evolution in his career as an artist. There were points that he wanted to express both musically and lyrically that were considered, by the record company, to be outside the box for an artist like Dan. Although the nabobs at the label conceded that the songs were good, they did not feel that the material suited Dan and his "image." As a result, the album, with wonderful songs like "Age of Simulation" and "The War Is Over" was not released.

Were there any other projects which Dan and yourself worked on which weren't released?

As far as I can remember, "White Boy" was the only project that Dan and I worked on that was not released.

What is your favourite Dan Hartman track and why?

Although it is an obvious choice and not one of our collaborations, my favorite Dan Hartman song is "I Can Dream About You." It is a perfect and timeless Pop song with an infectious opening bass line that still hooks me every time I hear it. Before one word is sung, the song captures me. When you say "Dan Hartman" to someone the response is inevitably, ”‘I Can Dream About You'...I love that song."

Can you tell us when you last saw Dan - how he was doing at the time - and any projects he was planning on working on in the future?

I last saw Dan in the hospital in New York City. He was very optimistic and expected to go back into the studio to record more songs for a new album that eventually became, “Keep the Fire Burning." Because I had moved to Los Angeles, we subsequently kept in touch by telephone.

Did you know Dan's family at all - any thoughts/memories you would like to share?

The only member of Dan's family that I knew well was his sister Kathy. She lived with him for a while in Westport and was going to school. I remember her as vivacious and fun loving. Dan loved her very much and wanted to assist her in getting an education.

Have you kept in touch with other artists and colleagues who worked with Dan?

I have not kept in close contact other friends and colleagues who worked with Dan. For a while after his death I communicated with some close friends of his but Dan was the link between us and without his presence the raison d'etre for keeping in touch dissolved.

Can you share a few personal memories of Dan?

My wife Susanna was pregnant with our daughter, Shantie, and we were having a baby shower at The House Of Music in New Jersey where I was producing a band. Dan showed up a little late which was his wont to do and so I thought nothing of it. He seemed out of sorts and I inquired as to how he was feeling. "It hasn't been a great day but I am happy to be here," was his reply. And, as always, he was the life of the party. Years later, when I visited him at the hospital, he told me that just hours before his arrival at the baby shower he had learned that he was infected with AIDS.

Dan and I had been writing together for a short while when he came to my apartment on 7th Street. We had not as yet committed to each other as writing partners but we were instantly and obviously simpatico. He entered my tiny one- bedroom flat on the third floor of a walk-up building, looking very serious. He sat down on the couch and without much ado asked if I was interested in being writing partners with him. I answered, with less ado, in the affirmative. Then he said, "but I want to let you know that I'm gay." I laughed and said, "my record just bombed and I'm working the graveyard shift as a legal proofreader."

What about Dan do you miss most?

The loss of Dan's friendship left a gaping hole in my life that cannot be filled. He was a mentor and a role model. I miss his courage, his humor, his generosity and his music. However, I am fortunate in that he left behind a way, besides our music, that we could be forever connected.

In his will Dan created the Dan Hartman Arts and Music Foundation and appointed me as the sole Trustee. Today our foundation, in the name of Dan Hartman, supports the education of talented young people in the arts. We support the music education programs of such institutes as The Mancini Foundation, The Music Center of Los Angeles, Interlochen Arts Academy and the Geffen Theatre in Los Angeles as well as aid the music education of various individuals.

May 2006

Many thanks to Charlie Midnight for his kind co-operation with this article.
© Copyright 2006-2024 - Charlie Midnight/DanHartman.com

Charlie Midnight - Music production and Songwriting:

James Brown
In 1986, Charlie wrote the entire Gravity album and was its associate producer. This album included the Grammy nominated "Living in America". In the process of producing this record, Charlie had the opportunity to work with Stevie Ray Vaughn.

Billy Joel
In 1988, Charlie wrote the Golden Globe nominated "Why Should I Worry?" for the Disney animated feature Oliver & Company, which was performed by Billy Joel. This song was one of the few songs that Billy Joel has recorded that was written by a writer other than himself.

Joni Mitchell
In 1995, Charlie wrote "How Do You Stop?" - the single from the Grammy Award winning Turbulent Indigo album. Joni is fiercely artistic and one of the most respected and influential songwriters and performers of our time.

Joe Cocker
Charlie produced two albums for him - "Unchain my Heart" and "One Night of Sin" - with both albums going multi-platinum. The "One Night in Sin" album included the Brian Adams-penned "When the Night Comes", which was a top ten single. Charlie also wrote numerous songs on both albums.

The Doobie Brothers
The Doobie Brothers had already sold 40 million records at the time they approached Charlie to produce and write for the Cycles Album. Included amongst the songs he wrote for that album was the top 5 single, "The Doctor". Cycles went multi- platinum. Because of his success, they then asked Charlie to produce the live album "Take Me to The Highway".

Chaka Khan
Charlie wrote "Can't Stop the Street", which was #1 on the dance charts for the film "Krush Groove." The soundtrack of which went gold.

Paul Young
Charlie wrote "I'm Only Fooling Myself" for the Time to Time album. This was one of the two new songs on his compilation album.

Dan Hartman
Dan was the respected singer/songwriter of the Edgar Winter group's "Free Ride"; the dance hits "Instant Replay" and "Re-light my Fire"; as well as the classic "I Can Dream About You".

We had a great mutual respect for each other. Besides getting together musically, we socialized both in Connecticut and New York. My wife Leba and I used to go to dinners and parties with Dan and his partner Glenn (who we still see in Los Angeles).

His studio was in his home in Westport, which made it a very comfortable place to record. His sudden illness and death was a shock to all who loved him. I was proud to have recorded two LP's with him. Now and Come See About Me. The latter was a collection of old Rock and Roll songs from the 50's & 60's. He was so respected that he was able to get such luminaries as Edgar Winter, Rick Derringer, Mary Wilson, Ashford & Simpson, and Gary U.S. Bonds to join me on several duets.

I loved working with him. He played, sang, wrote, mixed, mastered...he did it all! I would call him a genius. I went through all the trails and tribulations of I Can Dream About You with him.

We spent some great times in each other's homes both in New York and Connecticut. He was an icon to the R&B world, with his work with James Brown & Tina Turner. I remember writing some songs in a Greek Style, which I called "Bazuki Rock". He loved them and we recorded a couple together. He wasn't afraid to take chances musically.

I think of him often and smile!

Neil Sedaka

http://www.neilsedaka.com

June 2006

Many thanks to Neil Sedaka for his kind co-operation with this article.
© Copyright 2006/2024 - Neil Sedaka/DanHartman.com

Special thanks to Robert Cotto

We have been fortunate enough to be able to ask Chuck Ruff about his memories of Dan Hartman:

Q. What was it like working with Dan in the Studio? How did the songs evolve? 

A. It was always a joy to work with Dan in the studio. He was always in a good mood and very helpful. The songs were always pretty much in finished form with a few exemptions.

Q. What was it like on the road with Dan? Did he enjoy playing live? 

A. Dan was always up for having a good time when we were out on the road. A natural born practical joker. When we were on stage he was a powerhouse of energy and enthusiasm. Constantly moving around and giving eye contact to every one in the band.

Q. What was the song writing collaboration between Dan and Edgar Winter like?

A. Sometimes they would write one on one, and other times the would come up with an idea and go into separate rooms to see how they would do things differently.

Q.  Did Dan change in terms of the way he worked- over the course of the three albums the EWG recorded...?

A. No, Dan never changed per se. He did however improve a lot with each project.

Q.  How about memories of living at the estate in Long Island with Dan and Edgar-and recording Jasmine Nightdreams..?

A. We had great fun during the recording of "Jasmine Nightdreams". When Dan did his guitar solo on "Keep on Burnin'" he actually played with his teeth just like Jimi Hendrix. It was fun to watch him work and play. We also had several guest appearances such as Johnny Winter and Rick Marotta who is an excellent drummer. As a mater of fact he was playing drums for Edgar when I first met him.

Our house on Long Island was a palace. 47 rooms, private beach, tennis court, salt water swimming pool, about 2 acres of lush grounds to walk around on. Needles to say we were spoiled to death. Did I mention Dan's 24 track studio? He had it hard wired in to every room in the house including the bathrooms.

Q. Were you ever at The School House of Multilevel Studios? Were they owned and setup by Dan?

A. No I never had a chance to see the Schoolhouse. Yes, it was all owned and operated by Dan Hartman.

Q. What were Dan's other interests, apart from music?

A. Dan loved to go shopping in New York City. He also loved the Theater, Plays and Musicals.

Q. Dan's father appeared on the "Images" album, his brother was with him in the "Legends", what have they done since?

A. I don't know much about Dan's family life. I never had the pleasure of meeting his brother, but I did meet his Mom, Dad and little sister once backstage in Harrisburg, Pa.. They seemed like very nice people.

Q. What inspired Dan to experiment with so many different types of music?

A. I think it was his natural musical ability. He loved to try anything new.

Q.  What were Dan's musical tastes re other artists and bands?

A. Dan always listened to Motown and The Beatles, but he liked all types of music.

Many thanks to Chuck Ruff for his contribution.

Postscript: Chuck passed away in 2011. When I started putting this site together, back in the late 90s, Chuck got in touch and provided lots of information to me, including sending me a bunch of Polaroid photos for me to reproduce on the site. Very much missed, Rest In Peace dear Chuck.

When did you first meet Dan Hartman?

When the letter below arrived out of the blue after Dan had bought an import copy of "Still Loving You" which - despite major success in Italy and elsewhere - had never been released in the United States. It was handwritten

Multi-Level,

Westport

Dear Tom,

Seems like the time has come for me to write a short letter to you expressing my deep appreciation of your latest LP - "Still Loving You".

I've been living with it now for some months and always enjoy playing it. More than that, it always moves me - especially "Still Loving You" and some of the other thought-provoking pieces ("Tattoo"; "Spain"; "Love Town" & "The Wedding"). You've shown some real moments of emotion, anger, longing and warm romance; things we all experience & things we all dream of. Great record!

Best regards,
Dan Hartman
April 1987

It proved the beginning of a musical friendship that ended only with Dan's untimely death in March 1994.

When he next came to England, with his friend Richard, they came to dinner with my partner Sue and myself.

Can you tell us about your work with him?

On subsequent visits Dan came by my studio in Hammersmith and we wrote several songs together for my next album "We Never Had It So Good" (subsequently re-released as "Blood Brother")...in particular "Tomboy" - Dan was keen to help me write a fun, upbeat song about how a gay man could end up finding himself in love with a woman...

How was the decision made to have Dan play all of the instruments and do the vocals on "Tomboy?"

Actually Dan felt happiest making initial songwriting demos entirely on his own at home: so after he and I had knocked ideas around in London for a while, he took everything back to Multi-level and put together pretty complete demos for both "Tomboy" and "Kiss And Roll Over" which he mailed to me on Sony PCM 701 digital audio from America. This system used video tapes to store the information and we had endless problems because of the different PAL and NTSC standards in UK and US.

There was a third song that Dan never did demo and which as far as I know was never released, called "Alive In The Darkness".

Tell us about the song "Connecticut." Did you know that he was ill?

I had no idea that Dan had been ill - we hadn't heard from him for a couple of years, but with busy and successful friends pursuing a career in the music business that isn't so unusual. In the normal run of things, Dan would just call up again after a long absence and we'd pick up as if there'd been no break at all.

When our first baby was born in 1990 he went to Bloomingdales and sent us a load of Baby Dior clothes - he said he'd always wanted to go out and buy baby clothes, and we'd provided him with a perfect excuse.

Dan came to be respected as one of the great producers in music-can you tell us about his work and his skills as a producer?

He had a great understanding of the needs of both the artists he was working with, and of the commercial marketplace, and was able to uncannily find the common ground between the two. 

I remember before he pitched songs at Tina Turner for instance, he wrote and recorded two hugely commercial-sounding demos of new songs for her to listen to, where he'd not only played all the instruments himself but had done a note-perfect pastiche of her singing voice, so that she could hear how it would sound it she performed it. On the basis of those two demos (he later told us) Ms Turner then hired him to actually produce the remaining tracks on her album!

Dan experimented with many different types of music - which of his albums/tracks are your favourites?

Beyond a shadow of a doubt "Instant Replay" - it's so upbeat and infectiously optimistic. He told me that he wrote and recorded it when freshly and buoyantly, infatuatedly in love - and I think it shows in the grooves. And the sleeve artwork of the 12" single had all the notes written by Dan by hand - when I got his first letter out of the blue, the first thing I did was rush to my record collection to see if the signature was the same. It was!

Why do you think that there's so little information about Dan's background and personal life?

I fear Dan was very uneasy about the fact that he was gay, which is a huge shame. He suffered much prejudice and homophobia when he was young, and there's no question that it scarred him. It meant that his love life - which to Dan as an intensely romantic person was everything - still felt somehow furtive, to be hidden away and not quite respectable. 

Personally I'm convinced that Dan's homosexuality, the yearning and wistful erotic/tender longing deep in his soul, was the source of his great genius. Had fate made him a conventional rugged four-square beefy macho football-playing well-adjusted heterosexual mister nice-guy with a wife and two point four children, he would probably have stayed a jobbing bass player all his life. And how much poorer the world of music would have been as a result.

Can you share a few personal memories of Dan?

He was the most phenomenally motivated person it's ever been my privilege to meet. The word "can't" simply didn't exist in his vocabulary - it was always "why not?"

What do you miss most about Dan?

I miss his huge, abundant human warmth and generosity of spirit. Life is full of givers and takers - and Dan Hartman was definitely one of its biggest-hearted givers.

We shall not see his like again.

T x

Many thanks to Tom Robinson for his contribution.

Tom Robinson, a close friend of Dan Hartman, has dedicated "Connecticut" to Dan and included it on his "Having It Both Ways" album, released in 1996.

Connecticut (Robinson/Phillips/Fenner/Burt)

The message light was blinking as I walked in from the rain
The thunderclap erupted right outside my window pane
Across the cold Atlantic came a bolt out of the blue
I tried to lie and carry on but only thought of you

And it's raining in Connecticut
It's raining in LA
It's raining every place I go
Since you were blown away

Your laughter in the restaurant, the parties and champagne
The driven urge to prove yourself - to win and win again
The fortress that surrounded you - awards on all the walls
The demons in your darkness and the friends you never called

And it's raining in Connecticut, it's raining in LA
It's raining in the dead of night, it's raining every day
And it's raining in Australia - it's raining in Calais
It's raining every place I go since you were blown away

And I'm lost - tonight as I remember you
Your heart was even wider than your smile
And all you ever dreamed of was the one who'd love and hold you
As you carried on - now you're gone, gone gone

The echoes from the restaurant, of parties and champagne
The driven urge to win and win, your privacy and pain
The page of fading photographs, the bitter-tasting pill
The stranger we all knew so well... the friend we never will

And it's raining in Connecticut, it's raining in LA
It's raining in the dead of night, it's raining every day
It's raining in Australia - it's raining in Calais
It's raining every place I go since you were blown away

Yes it's raining in Connecticut, it's raining in LA
It's raining in the dead of night, been raining every day
Now it's raining in Australia, Bankok and Old Bombay
It's raining in the whole damn world
Since you were blown away

In memory of Dan Hartman d.1994

I have never spoken a great deal about Dan , and this seems like a good opportunity.

Dan was a true genius and a musical visionary, though in a style very different from my own. He loved pop music. The Carpenters were one of his favorites. Pop music is all too frequently dismissed as somehow shallow, lacking in depth or integrity. There is great pop music (just as there is great rock or blues).Dan made GREAT pop music, as well as rock and R&B.

I think "Diamond Eyes" is the best song Dan and I ever wrote together. It was definitely Dan 's idea. He had the title and the music for the chorus. When I asked him what it meant to him, he said, "you know ... looking for the beauty in life ... seeing the world as better, fresher, brighter than it is--like when we were kids." So I suggested, "We are children." He already had "Looking at the world through diamond eyes." And we were off.

We worked out the verses together, but the rhyme scheme is definitely an Edgar thing. I call these internal rhymes (we live so fast our life goes past before we ever know it), and I have a real penchant for rhymes like (magic rainbows and where the rain goes). As an example, take my song "What Do I Tell My Heart" (the ladies tease and taunt--I act so nonchalant--though I'm crying inside I keep trying to hide what I want) or (I look so debonair--but I don't have a prayer--though I'm nearing my end I appear to pretend I don't care).

While I'm on the subject of co-writing I might as well mention one little known fact (little known because I've never mentioned it). As most of you know, Dan had already written "Free Ride when I met him. But when we recorded the song, I wanted to be sure the message was understood as a "Free Ride" in the "Spirit" of self discovery. So I came to have the honor of penning the last lines (We've got to do better, It's time to begin--you know all the answers must come from within--so). Of course, I never asked for or expected any credit for such a small change; but I know lots of people out there who would have demanded co-writing (just for something like that). I'm just proud that the lines are in the song, which is such a CLASSIC! By the way, that IS Dan playing the signature guitar chord lick (not Ronnie or Rick), and I've never heard ANYBODY play it with exactly the same feel as Dan !

When I think of Dan Hartman, I will always think of "Paradise/Sides". For me, this is his supreme masterwork. It is entirely his own creation, and is uniquely Dan . Sides is so deeply personal and yet so universal, the beauty of it makes me cry. You sense he is talking about the pain of lovers in a relationship, and at the same time, the senseless misunderstandings between people of differing ideologies around the world. And the question is so profound, why must we take sides?

As much as I love some of the individual songs on the last (EWG) album, for me, it just didn't feel like a real group effort. It didn't have that intangible group spirit. As the leader, my main concern was to give everybody equal time and opportunity to display their talents. I had hoped to keep the band together by making it a democratic situation and splitting the song writing as evenly as possible. We followed this formula, but it still felt somehow unbalanced and unfocused. Dan and I were still writing together, but Rick's songs were all his alone. And there were no three way songs at all.

Don't get me wrong. I'm still very proud of this album, and I think everybody did an incredible job (especially Dan ). We're talking about matters of degree and personal taste here. My opinion is obviously subjective and influenced by my personal feelings. We were all disappointed by the lack of interest in the album, and I was rather sad--feeling the group was nearing an end.

And that brings us to the question, why was this album overlooked? In my opinion, it had nothing to do with the quality of the music. After Clive Davis left CBS things were never the same. Our manager, Steve Paul, had formed his own custom label, and we were releasing our records on Blue Sky. So technically, we were on our own label--yet depending on CBS distribution and expecting promotional support from their people in the field. I just don't think CBS had the same incentive and enthusiasm as when we were on EPIC. Well, that's my take on it. In any event, it is heartwarming and gratifying to hear how much you all care about this work.

Now, back to the original question of comparative success. Of course, the group would never have been the same without Dan . I had a very definite vision of the band and would have found someone with similar tastes and musical inclinations. But who that could have been, we'll never know.

As to my success, there is one important point that no one brought out. "Free Ride" was our first choice as a single, and was released when the album first came out. Unfortunately, it got no airplay and was never heard. It was only AFTER "Frankenstein" made it to #1 that "Free Ride" was re-released and subsequently became a hit.

"Frankenstein" started getting airplay on college underground FM stations. It was a real grass-roots movement, so requested that it was eventually demanded by AM radio. So, I guess you could say that if anyone was responsible for the success of the Edgar Winter Group, it was YOU--the people. I can only say, it was a great pleasure and a privilege to work with each member in the band, especially Dan , who contributed the most.

Dan and I remained the best of friends after the group disbanded. He was especially close to Monique (Edgar's wife). "Instant Replay" was the first song Dan recorded after the break-up, and I was touched when he asked me to do the sax solo. Monique knew everybody at Studio 54. I'll never forget the night we took it in and Monique had the DJ play it for the first time. We knew it was an "Instant Hit", and Dan was destined for great things.

I can't say enough about Dan , what an inspiration he was and how much his friendship and support meant to us over the years. We never lost touch and continued to do things together. On one trip to California, Dan did a session where I got to trade sax licks with Stevie Wonder's harmonica on the song "Hands Down" which was a real thrill and a great honor. On another, he invited me to solo on Tina Turner's "Simply the best", another great experience.

We last saw Dan shortly before he passed away. He came to LA for a visit. We had red wine with Monique's special pasta, which was Dan 's favorite. He had brought us a copy of "New Green Clear Blue, along with several books for Monique (they had a unique, spiritual bond--and loved to share philosophy). There was music, dancing, and deep conversation. We will always treasure this memory of the last time we spent together.

I felt that "New Green Clear Blue" marked a new evolutionary step in Dan 's writing. It is PURE music of the spirit with no commercial intentions--meditative, peaceful, and serene. For anyone who hasn't heard it, this CD reveals an entirely new and different side of Dan . I know it came straight from his heart and was a beautiful parting gift to us all. I can't help but wonder what he would have done next!

Aside from his amazing talent, the thing Monique and I admired most about Dan was his character as a person and his beautiful spirit. He was a steadfast, true, and loyal friend for life. He has our undying love, admiration, and respect. Though he has passed on to the other side, Dan has shown us all the way to "Paradise" where there are no "Sides". We all love and miss you, Dan . We shall meet again.

Peace and Love,

The Winters
Edgar and Monique

March 2005

JD: What did your band have that the other bands at the time didn't have?

LS: We were just kind of different right off the bat because we were a three piece band, there weren't many three piece bands out there. We dressed differently, we didn't wear jeans & t-shirts. We went out of our way to go to NY & Philadelphia to try to find obscure looking clothes. Now, they're not that big of a deal. Back then, the shirts had fringe, or sequins or weird stuff. We actually wore makeup to enhance our features (not like KISS or anything). Wearing it was totally different. We'd just wear odds & ends & weird makeup & clothes & our attitude was different. It all came from Dan Hartman - how we kind of grew into an image. He knew what he wanted to do and we kind of fell into it with him. He didn't force us. It was like he'd come up with this stuff and we'd just go That's great, that's great. We'd just all go along & fall into that situation. A lot had to do with originals, a lot of bands weren't doing originals then, the way we dressed, our attitudes and stuff. Back then we were young, had egos and thought Hey , we're the best. We didn't come off like that to people. I think we actually thought that. Everyone in the band was nice people, nobody had an attitude, nobody had an ego, just an inner ego. We never came off that way. Inside, that's what made us different. There's a band, people start to follow them & the next thing you know it just grows & grows and I can't think of anything outside of clothing and the way we approached things that made us different. There was a lot of good bands. We were that 3 piece band with a crazy guitar player, of course, we copied the Hendrix stuff - playing with his teeth, setting the guitar on fire, but nobody was doing that, it was fantasy. If you came out and saw us, you saw different little things like that. It was like Whoa! & the word spread and spread and spread. We went out and did every song that was popular then. We eventually got to do pretty much all originals and some cover songs. The music & the attitude made things a little different I'd have to say.

JD: At some periods you guys were really ahead of the time.

LS: Locally, regionally, I think we were. Definitely far ahead of the other bands. I guess, ahead of our time. It's hard to say.

JD: What was the favorite venue or spot to play in the heyday?

LS: We played every college, every fraternity, every high school, every swimming pool. Those were the top notch kids. You got to play swimming pool parties at the community pools, every pool within miles of our home. Back then it wasn't like today , for instance, Elton John's favorite venue is Madison Square Garden (MSG), you know, for other people, it's the Philadelphia old Spectrum. When Dan played in the band, there was a place called the Railroad House in Marietta, Pennsylvania. We used to play there. It was one of our favorite places. Those guys (the people who owned it) actually financed a record (High Towers / Fever Games ) & the studio session for us. They were really into the band. We played there Friday & Saturday night's. Two nights in a row. It was 9 p.m. to 1 a.m., all age. It was in the basement - a cold, damp, dirty basement in this building. The place would be packed all the time. It was a great place. The people were really good to us for many years. Then there was a place called the Country House in the Mechanicsburg area. A cool little one level, all age place. Always played on a Friday & Saturday night, always a two night weekend deal. People came in and sat on the floor and watched you. That place was run by Sunday, I think it was Tom Sunday. Those people went way out of their way to accommodate & take care of us every time we came. At that level, at that point in our careers, there was also a place called the Lodge in Dillsburg, PA, way out, in the middle of nowhere. It was an old ski resort. Some guy turned it into a 21 & under nightclub. That might have been one of the more favorite places on a routine, regular basis to play. That might have been after Dan Hartman left the band , after 71/'72. That kind of sticks out, we always looked forward to that because the place was packed like 1200 kids. They all sat on the floor, with no seats, drank soda & water & that was the extent of that. Other than that it was pretty much run of the mill. That was all they had back then. Teen dances. That was the early 70's. Everyone was either out in their car getting high or drinking & then coming in. Some were of age to drink, but it was a non-alcoholic place. 90% of venues that we played back then were alcohol free.

JD: What other musicians or bands did you share the bill with when you were performing live?

LS: Before Dan left, we did a lot of shows with Joe Walsh from the Eagles & the James Gang, a three piece band from Ohio. They had records out in the late 60's. The James Gang was Joe Walsh's band. We did a lot of shows with them in 70/'71. Like fairs, the York Fair, big grandstand fairs - pretty much of those shows were outdoor state fairs. We did stuff with the Beach Boys, we did shows with Aerosmith, around their first or 2nd album, other odds & ends with other people, some you might not remember. They're bigger now because they're oldies. Like Johnny Maestro & the Brooklyn Bridge, the band that did Kiss Him Goodbye, Steam. I think we also opened up for Yes in the very early stages. I remember Shippensburg University in Pennsylvania. I remember that distinctly. It was once or twice & we were huge Yes fans. We weren't on the bill with them, we were just kind of thrown in because we played the college all the time. Every college we played, there were lots of shows that we played. Let's get the Legends to fill in, they're a fun band! We weren't assigned to do these shows, just booked through the college. It was pot luck. That's off the top of my head. I don't think there's too many more than that.

JD: Do you have any memorable live show moments, any memories of strange things that happened, the moments that made it all worthwhile?

LS: I think every night you kind of felt it was worthwhile. That kind of feeling. It was kind of a special thing. Especially those kind of shows - Where you knew there was something kind of special going on and you'd hope it would get even bigger. Because back then we wanted to be rock stars. Now it's like I'm happy just playing. I don't do anything live. Maybe once every couple of years Ill do a couple live things with some people. I do a lot of studio stuff, but back then we always thought this was cool, it's going to get bigger and we always had aspirations that we're going to be big down the road. That didn't work out. Politics, quite a few other things, just being burnt out, and tired, frustrated and finally, like John <Lennon> said to Paul <McCartney>, Let's call it a day. I think every show was special in a way that's hard to describe. They all kind of felt different & unique. It wasn't like Here we go, let's get through this and go home. It was only like that towards the end, after many member changes. I kept hanging on to the thread thinking This is still fun & I'm making a couple bucks. You know, I'm not one of the original members of the band, but the 2nd generation, I guess, & drug that out to the mid 70's. Finally I had to let it go. It was getting worse.

JD: On the Quicktime movie snippet included on the High Towers double CD, the producer made a comment about taking you guys to Hollywood. Were you in the band for the fame or the actual music itself?

LS: I'd say both. <laughing> Well, that was the goal. Like yeah, we wanted to be rock stars. We thought we were. A very miniature version of it. We hoped that would continue, but I think it was both. We wanted the ego to get that far, but the music meant a great deal. I'm sure every band that has their original stuff feels the same way. They would never say We just wanted to make it for chicks. Lets get some chicks. Music is definitely a personal thing. However, I was a very small part of actually writing that music, but performing it was a whole different thing. A combination of music and ego or music and rock star. The stars in your eyes kind of deal.

JD: Did any songs transpire from true stories?

LS: You know, I think they did, but again, being a side musician, even though it was the Legends, Dan wrote every song. Joe wrote a few here and there. Dan wrote the majority of the songs. I know they all came from personal experience. Nothing personal for me. I was just the side guy, the drummer. Hey, you know, I was kind of Here's what to play, here's my input, what have you.

JD: Which were your favorite to play?

LS: You know, I don't even know if I could answer that. I had more fun actually playing a lot of cover stuff. We used to do a lot of Jimi Hendrix stuff, Grand Funk Railroad. All the old 60's stuff, British Invasion stuff. Original wise, - that's a tough question.

JD: So the cover songs would really get the crowd movin'? The originals might not have been familiar.

LS: After awhile, our originals took on the same flavor as the covers. They actually started to outgrow the cover songs. We'd say we're going to play so-and-so and people would cheer & go nuts. You got used to it after awhile. High Towers, Fever Games, Jefferson Strongbox, all the songs from the Baldwin Sessions, all felt the same when I performed them. I felt like I loved playing those songs. I looked forward to playing them all. I don't really have just one favorite song to play.

JD: I don't think there's a bad song on either disc.

LS: The 2nd disc is the earlier years. I don't recall doing any of that material, but I remember the band. That's how I got into the band. Following them in the early days when Dan and his brother had the band. A friend of mine said Hey, there's a band called the Legends down at the firehall! I'm like Yeah, OK. They were playing all kinds of British stuff. That's kind of how I got introduced to the band. I went to see them so many times. I just got bold one time, walked up and introduced myself to Dan Hartman and said Hey, I play drums too. Next thing I know, I saw them so many times, one night he just said, Hey Larry Sadler out in the crowd, why don't you come on up and play a song? I'm like What? Talk about panic! Their drummer didn't like any new music. He was into the R&B & much older type music. He didn't like playing Hendrix & couldn't stand Hendrix. The band wanted to get involved with Hendrix because they wanted to step up to date. So they asked me to come up and play Fire and Purple Haze. I got in & I'd go out to see them & every night they'd call me up to play those two songs because the drummer couldn't stand that music. Next thing I know, one day the phone rang and it was Dan. He asked How would you like to join the Legends? I'm like Yeah, that would be unbelievable! I couldn't imagine that happening, so I said, What's your point? He said, Well I'm asking you. I said, What are you asking me? I was that naive. I never even thought of playing in that band. I thought they were way above, I mean way above, what I had to offer. We recorded a lot of this stuff in the early days at the Baldwin Sound in Mechanicsburg, Pennsylvania. We did just about all the Legends stuff over there. It was a regular studio, really known for Gospel music back then. I played a lot after I got involved in the sessions with the Legends, I went over there and did many Gospel albums which was quite a change from playing Jimi Hendrix.

JD: Were you in school at the time?

LS: I left school in 9th grade to pursue my music career.

JD: Did your parent's support your decision?

LS: My parents supported my music from the very first day. When I was a little kid just messing around with tin cans and beating on stuff. They said What's going on here? My parent's were always way behind me. They said, Go for it! Anything like that. That was kind of unheard of back then. Back then it was always: you had to go to school, go to college, get a job, play your drums on weekends. I was like No! No! No! My schoolwork just began to go to the crapper. I was getting really bad grades and I was becoming rebellious in school. Getting the long hair, yelled at, suspended. My 9th grade experience was horrible. I don't even think I went to 9th grade basically. I have an 8th grade education. I just wanted the music. My parent's, I don't know what happened. After they realized about the school thing, they just said, Hey, whatever we can do. I got a part time job and eventually got into the music thing at age 16 - 17, making money in a band and working a part time job. Eventually, that went to I don't have to have a job, this is what I want to do, this is what I'm going to do and I'm still doing it. I'm doing a lot of different things out as a performer as much as I'm in the background. I still play my studio sessions which fills that gap for me.

JD: Do you think you were born with your talent? Is music in your genes?

LS: You know, there's nobody in my family that has any or had any music ability. None. I don't know where it came from. On either side of my family, nobody was musically inclined. Nobody had any interest in music. Nothing. Boom! All of a sudden I wanted to play drums. Then I started messing around with the drums. And then, the Beatles came to America. That first night, setting in front of the TV watching the Beatles live on Ed Sullivan, February 9th, 1964. Just like it happened yesterday. I know exactly where I was, what kind of TV we had, where my parent's were sitting in the room, where I was sitting, glued to that TV and I remember turning around to my parent's and saying That's what I'm going to do. Now I never got that huge, it was a very short time of that career, but I said that's what I'm going to do from that point. Fortunately, I've been able to do that, but on different levels and still stay in the music business. 95% of the people I grew up with and were in bands with or had bands back then, they don't even pick up a guitar or hardly think about music. This is what took place. Wow that's pretty cool. And I tell them different stories, different people I've worked with, tours. I have much more success as an individual than a band, with what I do now as far as production and stuff with bands than I could have ever dreamed with my own band. I see that nightly when I'm out doing a tour and I'm looking at the band going Damn, that should be me up there. You know? And I think I could play just as good as that guy and I could do that now and I'm twice this guys age. Sometimes I really think that way and I scare myself because that time came and went and now I'm doing this. It's because of the love of performing and playing. I get just as excited before a show like I was in the band if I get close to a band I'm out on the road with. I get real close to them, they say, Oh yeah, you used to play drums in the Legends. I remember Dan Hartman. What's that song you had out? That's pretty cool. That's as far as it goes. I get just as keyed up and excited as the bands do before they go on stage. I did so many things that I thought were important at one time, musically, along the way, many years. Now it's to the point where somebody can say, Hey, you can go out on the road with Todd Rundgren for 16 dates. And I'm like, Nah, I don't want to. It's kind of neat, I can actually turn that down. Not that I'm filthy rich or anything, but it's getting to the point where it's nice that I survived this long in music and now I can actually turn things down. I'm thinking This is kind of cool. I mean, I don't have a Grammy sitting on my shelf saying I'm successful in the music business, but I am for what I've grown up and gone through without any education basically. Growing up on the streets with music in the early days when you didn't have all these monster sound systems and lighting things. We went out, you were lucky if you could hear us singing in our little PA system. We had two colored flood lights and we thought we were the kings. A red Christmas light on one side and a blue Christmas light on the other side shining on the stage and we were like, Whoa! We're miles above these bands. And we were! I mean some of these bands didn't even have PA systems. They were out singing into nothing.

JD: Did drugs have any impact on your career or the music?

LS: I wish......No, not really

JD: Was there anyone who helped or inspired you along the way?

LS: Nobody really helped me. I just wanted to play drums. I didn't have anyone I wanted to be like when I started to play. This was early. This is when I'm setting down, putting records on my parent's old turntable and beating the drums to the song. I had favorite songs, but I didn't want to be THAT drummer, but I love that song, so I'd want to learn it. Like Wipeout, of course, all the early British Invasion stuff, the Kinks, the Beatles. People say when I'm performing live with the early Legends that I had that kind of animal instinct. They'd say, Man you're totally different off the stage than when you're playing. I was afraid of you when I saw you playing. Now you're this nice, little, shy guy, timid and this and that. I don't think I was too extreme. Kind of a happy medium. Not really wild. People would say, You wouldn't believe the physical appearance you exude off the stage and the faces you make while you're playing. I'd say, What do you mean? Back then, you couldn't go out and videotape the band tonight. We didn't have that luxury so we couldnt study ourselves like all the bands do nowadays. Of course, they took black and white pictures. That's a pretty ugly face! Yeah, I look like that? Yeah you look like that pretty much when you're into these songs! That's pretty ugly man. You'd think I'd like to have a girlfriend. Not with those faces, you'd scare everybody off. That's another funny thing. It's just all stuff, even like the old R&B, the British stuff, even early British stuff before the Beatles hit, that was the big British Invasion, when all the other British bands came out. It wasn't any particular song. As time went on, I grew to have idols. People I wanted to be like, but unfortunately, they were way above what I could do. They were more inspirations. Later on in the 70's bands, even today, I'm into everything from classical to the new country. I love all the new country stuff because it sounds to me like it's the old 70's rock. People go, You love country? I go, Some of my favorite new artists are country people and you got to listen to this CD. It's not what you think - Yeehaw, foot stompin', hillbilly country. This is like country rock. Rock solid. Like early 70's rock music with a different edge. I turn all these people on to it. Then they have to go out and buy that CD. Like Rascal Flatts, Keith Urban, you know, country guys. There's a slew of them. They're not my favorite bands, but the music is really good. I did short little things with the Faith Hill & Tim McGraw tours. When they go out and rock, the band goes out and blows any 70's rock band away. I go, I can't believe this, these guys are phenomenal. Then they get back into the country, the old country music, like Merle Haggard, that I still don't like listening to. Kurt Cobain and that whole grunge thing was OK for a while. Then it got drilled into our heads. The guy's not John Lennon. Then I get to Greenday, still like them, one of my favorite bands. My taste goes all over the place, from Winger to Ozzy, then I'll switch to Elton John or Led Zeppelin, the Beatles. I've grown a whole lot since back then so there's way too many. I still know a lot of guys my age who only listen to Jimi Hendrix, the Rolling Stones, the Beatles, That's it - that's all I listen to. And I say, Wow, you just missed 40 years of some pretty good music & some really crappy music. There's a lot that you missed. You got to be more open minded than that.

JD: Is that what you're listening to lately?

LS: Yeah, I'd say I am. I'm still always listening to that 70's stuff, always the 60's rock. I love all the 60's stuff. Iron Butterly, Gerry & the Pacemakers, Herman's Hermits, the corny stuff, Jefferson Airplane, all the British guys from the 60s, every British band. To this day, if I hear it on the radio, I still have to crank it up. I was never a fan of the Grateful Dead, never will be. I don't know why. There's just something about that I don't appreciate. I don't know what it is. I could never figure it out. Never been into the hip hop. I've been into the R&B side, the harder edge, not the rap. I could listen to anything from the 60's & 70's. I went through the 80's thing with a band called the Sharks from Lancaster, PA. I was their soundman for 5 years so I went on the road with those guys. I love all the 80's music. I love all the 60's. The 70's were cool and then disco came along and ruined it. I'll listen to disco, but from far away, I won't purposely turn it up. I don't get a lot of the music today. I still like the simple, your basic rock and roll stuff. That's where my roots are. Give me a couple guitars, drums & somebody singing and thats fine by me. I don't need all the synthesizers, electronics and all the computer generated stuff.

JD: Who would you have liked to share the stage or collaborate with?

LS: Jimi Hendrix - I wouldn't want to rattle anything off the top of my head just to answer the question. That's definitely a thought process.

JD: What do you think the best and least favorite parts of your peak decades are?

LS: How music developed, the early stages, the exciting part, the conclusion of the songs & how they developed musically speaking. Other than that the favorite part was money, the least favorite part, no money. The development of the music and how it built up to that point, not having money to having money. I don't know how many people have a lot of money, I don't care who you are. It's all relevant. You have these billionaires, and like in four years they have to sell everything. They're broke. They're gone. You're a billionaire four years ago, now you don't have a penny. How does that happen? So many people just went bankrupt as an individual because they blew all their money.

JD: What do you think could change or improve music for the better in 2007 & continuing years?

LS: Things change so much. I think it's all in the record companies and producers. There's so many bands out there now. When I was growing up and had the band, there were a lot of bands. Now, it's totally polluted. I listen to this stuff that are hits on the radio and go How is that a hit? I love the music, I just don't love the song. That's different too. It's just weird. I love the way it's performed and played. I just don't like the song, it's a bad song done well. I think, How in the world is that #1 for four weeks? What am I missing here? It's not that I dropped out of the music or that I don't care about music anymore or gotten jaded, there's just tons and tons of that stuff everyday. You'll pick up a magazine or you'll listen to the radio and they'll say that's #1 for the last 3 week and you're like #1 what? #1 piece of crap? I think it's really the record companies that got to be more responsible for themselves. They're all out for the money. There's so much crap out there now that kids are buying and making people billionaires and I'm thinking, Well what's in that? It's not that I don't like it, it's just that I don't respect the song, the way it was written, how it was written or what it really means. Christina Aguilera, Britney Spears, all that stuff, Justin Timberlake - I get into the music as a musician, I listen to it, but then I listen to the lyrics, there's hardly any lyrics in the new stuff, but there's meaning somewhere, but I don't get it. When I was young, it was like 3 bucks for an album. Do you want the mono version or the stereo version because the stereo version is $1 more. Three or four bucks. Now it's 20 some bucks for a CD & kids are running out because they like two songs on it. It's amazing. The record companies, producers, people like that need to be responsible - it's really confusing.

JD: With music today, there's also a lot of overhead than there was before. I don't want to go to a concert and see a big, over-the-top production all the time or throughout the whole show. I want pure music & talent. Lyrics, music.

LS: That's usually what you get nowadays. It's pretty rare to go out and see a major event without it being over the top. I'd take a good ole nightclub with hardly any lights, not a big PA system, but a really good band. I'll go out with friends and they'll go, Man this production sucks. And I'll say, We came to see the band, who's coming to see the lights & hear the sound? Back then we had everything in three cars. Now it's like 22 semi tractor trailers,14 tour buses and this is for like one guy. You got this massive 90x80 foot stage for three guys in a band. What's going on here? I look out in the crowd and think, These guys are paying like $199 to sit there. They just wanted to come see the band, they didn't come out for the production. Although, a lot of people leave a show and feel they didn't see any pyro or the sound wasn't that good or it was tough to see the band in certain lights. How about the band? Oh they were great! Everything is way out of hand. You go to a Rolling Stones concert and spend $5,000 for a front row seat. And the bands let this happen. They're just as bad. It's crazy how things have gotten. It's just getting worse. I'd spend my day going to see Grand Funk Railroad, top band in the country for $3. You'd go into an arena seating 8,000 people, first come, first serve. They didn't have seating then. You paid your $3, you had your ticket, BOOM. You ran in real fast, trying to get up front & sit there. You got a great 90 minute show for $3. There was no big lights, no big sound system, a couple lights, sound system adequate for the venue, but it was great. The last time I went to see Grand Funk Railroad was 5 years ago. It was like $62 and the seats were horrible and it was a big production, but the band was great. I wanted to see the band, keep that in mind. They sounded better than they did when they first came out. After I left there, I was happy. That's what counts. I know people in both worlds, who paid money who thought the production was great, then other people just want to go see the band. The band is first. Not many people want to go to see Van Halen because they heard they have a great light show.

JD: How did you bridge the gap between music, the life of a musician and your personal life?

LS: I always felt it was just all one thing, that it's just the way it is. I never thought of how I kept this and that together to make it one. There was no bridging. Never thought about it, I assume I just took it for granted. It's all I knew, how I grew up. There was no connect the dots, it was just like Hey this is just the way it is. You got your time, you got the music. I got married really young and it was a mistake. It was right around 69. Joined the band in 68/'69, a really crucial time, and a baby was on the way. The marriage just didn't work out because I was the musician and I was selfish. That was priority. Family? Yeah, OK - whenever I get home. That was my attitude at that age, the rock star attitude. I was married maybe a year after my son was born and that was it. It was definitely weird back then, but then again, I was considerably young to get married back then, have a baby right away, be in this band and have no education outside of music. And I thought, I'm sticking with this, my priority, the music. 18 years old, it was a rough time, it wasn't horrible, another hump to get over. That's just how it went. The family, the music, everything - it was all just one thing.

JD: Was there ever an event that made you want to throw in the towel?

LS: No, not really. When I was younger, when I'd get really mad at something, I'd easily say, the hell with it, fine, whatever. I went through that a lot. It never really meant anything. I never actually took it any further than being pissed at the time. I don't think there was ever any one time where I said, This is not worth it, forget it. I never really had any reason to want to throw the towel in.

JD: What is the best advice you can pass on and share from your own experiences?

LS: Try something else other than music. I have a lot of friends with kids. And they ask, "What can you tell him?" Put your band together & have fun. Keep it fun. It's just my attitude from going through so much. Maybe if I had to do it all over again, I'm not sure. See, I had no choice. When I first got into music, it's just something that gets into you, it gets in your blood. I don't know why. I don't know how - the Beatles were a huge part of it. Listening to music, my brothers & sisters were listening to 50's music as I was growing up. I didn't take to it, but I slowly got into it, because they were always playing the music. Nobody was musically inclined, nobody even thought about being a musician. Most of the kids in the 50's listened to doo wop and that's how I got into it. I slowly slid into the 60's. The love of music just got into me. If I had to do it all over again, I'm not sure. I didn't choose it, it came to me. I guess those kind of decisions you didn't have control over. It's hard to say, If I had to do it all over again, forget it! That wouldn't be fair to say. To pass along or suggest anything, anymore, I'd just try to tell people to keep it real & keep it fun. If the fun goes out of it, you might as well forget about it, it will drive you crazy. It's really, really hard to come out and be a brand new band, a songwriter and strive for that ultimate thing, but hey, it's done everyday. I tell these parent's, I suggest getting an education and doing something else. They all laugh. Partly, I'm serious. Some kids go through the phases where they have to have a guitar, I have to have drums, I want to be a singer, I want to play piano, take lessons, I want to take tap lessons, this & that & two months later theyre over it. It's like a novelty. It wears off. That's probably what I thought was happening to me at the very beginning. My parent's probably thought that and then eventually as time went on it became serious. Eating, sleeping - everything was music & the band. You don't loose interest in it.

JD: Do you think the Legends music ever felt done or is there that one last song out there that we need to hear?

LS: I think it ran its course. I think that's finished and I think the best was what you've probably heard & are listening to. Maybe had Dan Hartman stayed with the band & we went on, yeah, it probably would have been better, with better material. Because of his departure, that was pretty much the beginning of the end for the Legends, when he left. We all knew it. I drug it on for years because of my love for it. It worked & it was fine, it just wasn't the same. Even though there was very few songs after that written, it wasn't the same. It ran its course early in the 70's. It was finished. Like a marriage, when you're still in love with the person, but they're not in love with you so you do everything possible to drag it out as long as you can and hope for the best. Most of the time that doesn't work. Had Dan stayed, who knows what would have happened? I think it pretty much ran its course. It ran out of steam and patience as everyone got older. It didn't' materialize like I thought it would 10 years before that. We had a good, long run. The original Legends, 2nd generation, then there was 2 more generations of the Legends after that, but rarely any originals. It just changed hands every few years until we realized it was too much work and it wasn't paying off. We really loved it, but we had to let it go & that was really hard to do. It wasn't like, OK let's break up, I hate you guys, I don't want to see you again big fights. We all just realized we weren't going to get much further and we're driving ourselves crazy. I think it's called, we matured. It was definitely a good run on a really small level. There wasn't much going on in the later years. No regrets. There's nothing I would change. It all just took its natural course & that was pretty cool for the time being.

JD: What would you find yourself listening to on a long road trip?

LS: My iPOD is jammed full with everything from jazz and classical to heavy metal. It just depends on my mood. That's why I pack that thing full of everything I like. I got a couple albums of heavy metal & when that wears off I can go back to 60's stuff. Then I'll listen to classical for a while. To each his own. Just make sure you get all your favorite stuff together.

JD: Do you have any favorite albums, artists or songs for when you're feeling romantic?

LS: Johnny Mathis is great romantic stuff. Older stuff by the Temptations and the Four Tops. Lots of classical music is that seductive type. If you were asking me when I was 16, it would be bands without all the love stuff.

JD: Do you have any artists or albums you can't live without or that you find yourself always revisiting?

LS: There's nothing I can't be without because the choice is so wide. I tend to always go back to the 60's type stuff, Paul Revere & the Raiders. That was great. I remember watching the afternoon shows & Dick Clark. All that stuff was fun & enjoyable. So many different artists from that era.

JD: Are there any lyrics that blow your mind?

LS: No, because I have a terrible habit of listening to the music first and judging songs most of the time from how it's performed & how it's sung. Then I'll go, Oh yeah, there's lyrics . That's probably why I've never been a songwriter. There are lots of lyrics I like, but too many.

Larry's closing remarks:

Over the years, I've slowly backed off. Not getting bored with it, I'm just starting to feel jaded & losing appreciation for it. The older you get, the harder it is. I realized you don't HAVE to do this, you don't HAVE to do that. Just keep things limited. I haven't lost the desire, just more of the people & new music that kind of got me in that frame of mind sometimes. I'm on the whole other end of it, playing studio work & the production stuff I'm involved with. That keeps things interesting. I work in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania & New York City as a studio musician now a couple times a month, anything from a particular artist to unknown artists that are just getting signed & need backup bands to radio jingles, TV commercials (CBS sitcoms, Levis, 7-UP, Sears, Canada Dry), motion picture soundtracks (around 30, from Rocky to stuff with Goldie Hawn, Billy Crystal, Melanie Griffith, Harrison Ford, Brad Pitt, Steve Martin). That's pretty much what I cover in the studio. Basically, what I'm doing now is studio work, I work for Electric Factory Concerts, Clear Channel Entertainment. I have my own production company on a small level called Sunrock Productions. That's about it. In the summertime, I get really busy off and on the road with Clear Channel Entertainment as an assistance production manager. Backstage politics on different tours. There's rarely any lengthy tours anymore that I have any interest in going away from home for an extended period of time. Other than that, I'm still hired as a lighting and sound technician / director for different local bands or venues. I can run the stage if I'm available. Still involved every way except playing live. It's nice because over time I can pick and choose. I don't HAVE to do certain things. I kind of set my own schedule. That all stems from my early career as a musician that allowed me to pick and choose at this time. Totally unemployed or working too hard. Larry still resides in the Harrisburg, Pennsylvania area when he's at home.

Many thanks to Julia Dwilet for allowing this interview to be reproduced. Used with permission.

2007

What were your first impressions?

Energy!- A BIT OF A HUSTLER. He did that James Brown accent/impression he was so fond of doing "Holly....You Bad!"

Dan had a lot of Stamina in the studio, he could keep working when everybody else's ass was draggin'. He was so much fun, but could be a pain. Always on the phone sorting out the next songwriting or producing gig.

He wore cowboy boots with the jeans tucked in:-)

He was very confident and competent. He could impersonate almost any singers voice and patched up a few dodgy vocal takes. Although he said he couldn't do me.

He was a bit closety about his sexuality as far as the Music Industry was concerned , He was more open with Gay musicians and colleagues however. He discovered that he was HIV Positive while he was working with me apparently. But he didn't tell me. In fact he never told me even after he heard that I had gone public about my HIV status in 1991. Which was kind of strange.


How did "Atomic City" come about?

I had all the lyrics and vocal ideas already sorted out but needed someone to sort out the structure, Dan came up with the funky bassline and made it work. He asked for 10% of the song!-0


Did you have any other projects lined up with Dan?

Regretfully I didn't ask him to do my second solo album, he was a bit miffed. I should have done with hindsight. We did meet up whenever he was in London though.


Were you ever at Multi-Level Studios-Dan's recording studio in Westport, Ct?

Yes We reworked a track on the BLAST album there. Me and my partner Wolfgang spent New Years at his home 1988-9. S.U.C.C.E.S.S. was a demo of mine that he loved. Stephen Hague had botched it up a little so we recreated the demo version. It was a very compact but professional studio. Where he had made some great stuff in the past. It was an extension to his house. James Brown recorded Gravity there and the song SUCCESS was inspired partly by that track so it seemed very appropriate.

On a shopping trip to Westport Dan would not go into K-Mart. He could not believe that these hip Europeans thought it was a great store, so kitsch. To him it was just low class. He was funny like that.


Can you tell us when you last saw Dan- how he was doing at the time-and any projects he was planning on working on in the future..?

He was working with Paul Young at Olympic Studios. He had got into spiritual Healing which he talked about. Our last phone conversation was a bit strange.


What is your favourite Dan Hartman song and why?

I Can Dream About You was very cool but Living In America and Relight My Fire are favourites also.

Many thanks to Holly Johnson for his contribution.

So we began a search for a stateside producer who understood both rock and dance music and that eventually led to my meeting with Dan at his hotel near Swiss Cottage.

What were your impressions of Dan when you met him?

Confident, charming, witty and very knowledgeable on the current UK pop scene, which surprised me a little. My interest in Dan as a producer was mainly based around his then recent work on the James Brown ‘Gravity’ Album. The band was not James’s group but players that Dan had put together and recorded. It had all the right funk power and rhythmic ingredients that we were seeking but I wanted to see if Dan shared my vision of taking that sound and throwing lots of noisy guitar over the top. Also to be honest I was checking to see if we could get some of those players from Gravity onto our album. We discussed his Edgar Winter years, the disco hits and his song writing credentials. I remember walking away from the evening very impressed.

'Joy' was recorded at Multilevel - can you tell us how long it took to do the recording and what was it like working with Dan in the studio?

Later that summer, following a Japanese tour with King I flew to Dan’s home to meet up with Charlie Midnight with the aim of collaborating on new material. The intention was that any songs created would be for Kings next album but apart from the dates in Japan by this time the band had pretty much fallen apart.

In truth this situation suited Dan better as now he was free to pull together the kind of players he felt more confident recording with. We taped 85% of what was to become the ‘Joy’ album at Multi level during late fall and winter of 1986-87. As well as being a talented musician, composer and producer, Dan was also an excellent recording engineer. He was responsible for all areas involved in running the sessions be that controlling the desk to microphone placements on drums and instruments. I remember when we had finished the sessions sitting in the control room in Multilevel with a friend who was a sound engineer listening back to the master tapes. As we sat raising the faders it was an incredible realisation that the tracks sounded as if they were already finished. Dan had recorded the songs so perfectly that very little fixing was required to create the impression of what was the final record.

Did you meet any other artists whilst at Multilevel?

Not so much at Multilevel. As I said the majority of the tracks were taped in Westport but this mainly involved the rhythm and percussion parts along with bass, guitars and keyboards. Other artists such as Nona Hendrix who was a good friend of Dan’s, Carlos Alomar the guitarist and the Uptown Horns whom Dan had used on the Gravity sessions with James Brown, we recorded in New York at Green Street Studios.

The one exception was the backing vocals session for the album at Multilevel with Aretha Franklin’s backing singers. I remember this as a wonderful day. Caroline Franklin, Aretha’s sister and composer of some Aretha’s best songs, was part of the group and it was a genuine ‘joy’ listening to them offer so much soul and beauty to the tracks we were creating.

How did you collaborate with Dan and Charlie Midnight when writing the songs for the album? How did the songs evolve?

I remember it all being very comfortable, relaxed and quick. Dan and Charlie had put some homework into myself as singer and performer. They’d listened to King material watched the concert footage and videos as well as reading some press interviews. They had a vision of what material they could bring to the table to develop the groups sound and direction. We had two days of writing, Charlie had some lyrical themes we agreed to work with, Dan had some tunes up his sleeve and so did I so it felt like a very easy creative atmosphere. In those two days we sketched out around 6 songs, in fact it was such a positive session and experience it became the deciding factor in my leaving the band.

Did you do any other work with Dan?

Yes we did. This would have been the late summer of 1987 after the album was released; Dan came to London and suggested we get together to work on some more tunes. We spent a couple of days writing in a Soho studio and recorded four songs.

What is your favourite Dan Hartman song and why?

‘I can dream about you’ I’ve always been a sucker for blue-eyed soul when it’s done well. It’s a beautifully crafted tune with a great vocal performance.

Can you tell us when you last saw Dan- how he was doing at the time-and any projects he was planning on working on in the future?

The last time I saw him was in a restaurant in Chelsea where he and a number of other writer producers were having dinner with Tina Turners manager pitching material for her next album. That must have been around 1988.

The last time I spoke to him would have been 1993; I was producing at VH1 and MTV had asked me for some ideas on names and contacts to approach for a special on Disco they were creating. I called Dan to see if he would be interested in being a contributor.

He wasn’t too well at that time but pleased to hear from me. I guessed because of his illness he didn’t want to be involved in the Disco show.

Can you share a few personal memories of Dan?

Lots really. Plenty of pasta cooking, Dan had found a company in Arizona who supplied different sorts of fresh pasta which was the mainstay of our diet during sessions at Westport. He liked sitting and talking in the evenings with a nice wine and good music. We played a lot of records in the evenings I recall him playing me Tom Robinson’s record that he really loved. Also I remember Dan taking me to Paradise Garage in New York a nightclub that has since taken on legendary status for the dance and house music fraternity. I thought the whole thing was amazing, the club, the people and the music; Dan was less impressed; he thought it was merely a poor versions of disco. We went a number of times as Dan knew most the DJ’s and we seriously discussed changing the whole approach on my album into the Paradise sound or what were calling a dance record but has since come to be known as house music. 

What do you miss most about Dan?

He was a huge talent and fun person. We only worked with each other for about a year and although I would not describe us as great friends I do think on Dan with fondness and affection. I learnt from him during what was a growing period in my career and life. I miss the fact that we no longer have the opportunities to hear music from a man who so obviously loved the thing that he did and did so well.

Many thanks to Paul King for his contribution.

Martyn produced Terence Trent D'Arby's 'Hardline' album and worked with Dan Hartman on hits for Tina Turner. Martyn has also worked extensively writing music for film, theatre, TV and Radio.

Tell us about when you first met Dan Hartman?

I first worked with Dan on ‘Circle of Light and ‘Shadow Boxing’. Dan had heard about my work with Heaven 17 and was also familiar with the Human League and asked me to work with him because he liked the modern British 'urban sound'. We agreed to meet at Swan Yard, near Highbury Corner in London and I presumed that Dan would bring his own gear along with him - in fact he turned up with nothing as he thought that I would have all the necessary gear! This resulted in a rather ‘chilly atmosphere’ between us but we soon started to get on together exceptionally well.

How did the creative process work between you and Dan?

Well, to start off with Dan seemed a bit reticent about playing the keyboards and expected me to take the lead as the producer. Dan worked in a different way to most producers and we worked together as like minded spirits, rather than by pure direction. We got on together extremely well.

What is your favourite Dan Hartman track?

Although it is a song he performed with the Edgar Winter Group, I'd have to say ‘Frankenstein’ as I love the Galillan Keyboard.

Do you have any amusing anecdotes you could share about Dan?

Dan was fascinated with British culture and loved Indian food, especially when hot and spicy. He said that Indian food was not the same in the USA. I knew a local Indian restaurant and took him along there and, without Dan’s knowledge, we asked the staff to make Dan’s dish extra hot.

During the time Dan tucked into his meal it was plain that the dish was seriously spicy but Dan did  not admit that it was too hot for him. He retired to the toilet to take a break from it and we put extra lime pickle on his plate for when he returned to the table.

What’s is you abiding memory of Dan?

A very charming person who I feel never reached his full potential because of his untimely passing.

Many thanks to Martyn Ware for his kind co-operation with this article.
© Copyright 2006 - Martyn Ware/DanHartman.com

http://www.illustriouscompany.co.uk/

I grew up in Elizabethtown, PA and remember seeing the "Legends" at the Railroad House in Columbia, PA...also at the Mount Joy Pool 'Splash' Parties. He was absolutely fabulous. (late 60's)

The next time I saw Dan was with Edgar Winter a few years later, and again he was better than ever. (Early 70's)

Later, as I moved from PA to Boston, and was on the road as a musician, I had the chance to record, write and produce "Dance" music for various labels in New York. This was around the time of 'Instant Replay' , and 'Relight My Fire'... Our record "Kind Of Life" (by Northend) on Westend Records was doing very well, and the label always mentioned that we should have the appeal and magnetism of Dan Hartman. No small task.

After doing various types production work, and now as an Assistant Professor in (MP&E) Music Production & Engineering Department at Berklee College of Music in Boston, I find myself still wishing that I would have had the chance to work with Dan, or at least had known him on a personal level.

Dan made a rather big impression on this musician, and I am proud to say that I spoke to him briefly at the Railroad House, I was about 14 at the time, and he actually took the time to speak with a 'kid'...very cool.

May God Bless you Dan, and your music has found a special place in many hearts.

A-fan-always...Tony Carbone

www.tonos.com/tcbone

I've visited this site many times and have thought about sending a comment many times and today, March 22, the 17th anniversary of Dan's passing I finally decided to write a little something.  There are many people and many of my close friends who were closer to Dan than I ever was but I did have a lot of great times with him over the years.  When he was living in Harrisburg, PA and playing with his band The Legends, long before his successful recording and production career with Edgar Winter and beyond, I knew he was going to be a major force in the music industry.  We all knew.  He was an amazingly talented musician, singer and songwriter.

I started showing up at The Legends shows completely in awe of Dan and the whole band.  We eventually became friends and my own band at the time called Shanghai was being booked and managed by the same booking agency that The Legends were handled by and so we played many shows together.  Dan and me and a couple of other guys in my band used to drive up to New York together to go to the music stores on 48th street and buy new equipment.  It was exciting to be in NY walking around all the big music stores but the real treat was the hours we spent driving back and forth to NY and having that time to talk to Dan about music or whatever the topic of the day was.  He was the most optimistic, happy, funny, uplifting and over all talented person I've ever had the pleasure of spending time with.

Dan stopped by my family's house on Christmas a few years in a row.  We always had a big open house with lot's of food and all of our friends coming in and out.  We would sit and listen to whatever new albums I got for Christmas and just talk about music for hours at a time.  Dan even wrote a song and produced a recording session for our band around that time.  When he got the gig with The Edgar Winter Group we were all so happy and ecstatic for him - and for ourselves a little bit too.  It was great having a home town friend going on to make it big in the business and it confirmed what we all knew about Dan all along.  After he was settled and working with Edgar and they moved into their big house in Sands Point, Long Island I went up to visit him a few times and stayed as a guest there in the house with Dan and Edgar and Chuck Ruff.  It was a magical time for me to be exposed to such amazing talent.  Hanging out and spending close social time with those guys was a pivotal period of growth for me as a musician and as a person.  They had built a recording studio into the house with a main control room and virtually every room of the house wired for recording.  They did a few of their albums there and it was at that time observing Dan as he acted as recording engineer and producer that I developed my love for all things studio-related and it's what eventually led me to become a recording engineer and producer myself.

Over the years I stayed in touch with Dan from time to time through the occasional phone call but I didn't see him too often.  I visited Dan once at his first house in Westport, Connecticut, the house where his studio called The Schoolhouse was located.  And when I was on the road playing with a band in Connecticut another time I stopped by his last residence where his Multi-Level studio resided and he showed me all around that amazing home.  At that time he had just finished "I Can Dream About You" and the music for the soundtrack he was working on and he took me in the studio and played me some of the tracks. As always, I was amazed at what he had done.  A few years later in early 1994 I was doing a showcase at The China Club in New York for several record labels with my original band and I called Dan to invite him to come down for the show.  The producer who was helping us promote ourselves to a few record executives was Chris Lord-Alge and I knew that Chris had worked with Dan on a few albums in the past so I thought it would be great if Dan could come down to NY and lend us a little support.  He said that he would have loved to but he was just too busy to make the trip on that date.  He never let on or said anything about feeling bad or being ill but it was just a few weeks later when he passed away.  I was devastated to hear the news.

Dan was simply the most prolific, extraordinary, talented person I've ever met as well as being a warm, kind, considerate and fun guy.  I am constantly wondering about all of the great music he would have made if he had lived longer.  However, we are fortunate to have his great body of work left for our enjoyment.  Dan was one of the most influential people in my early musical career.  He taught me a lot of things and I have never forgotten any of them.  We all miss you Dan.  You took us all on a great Free Ride in life.

I am still very close friends with Larry Sadler, Dan's drummer from The Legends and we have had many, many . . . MANY long conversations about Dan over the years.  Larry still lives in Harrisburg and I now live in New Jersey but we'll talk for hours on the phone about the old days and reminisce over the exciting times we had with Dan and with our respective bands Shanghai and The Legends back in those wonderful care free days of our youth.

Ahh, such great memories about such wonderful music and amazing people.  Thanks for the opportunity to take this walk down memory lane again and give my little personal perspective of a truly great human being.      

Bob Kimmel
Major Music Productions
308 Killington Court
Mays Landing, NJ  08330
Phone:  609-703-5458
Web Site:  www.BobKimmel.com

March 2011

Ed was the manager/valet for the EWG when Dan was in the group during the early 1970's

Can you tell us when you first met Dan Hartman and can you share some of your experiences growing up with Dan in Harrisburg?

I first met Danny around 1966, or so, in Harrisburg. He used to live a few blocks away from me and we had some fun times together then. I remember driving around Harrisburg. in his blue Ford Galaxy 500 convertible with the top down and at that time 8-track tapes were the big thing.

But Dan took it a step further, he had a record player hooked up on the floor of the car so we could listen to our favorite tunes in "45" format instead of messing with the radio or the tapes which didn't always have all songs that we liked on them.

Did you know that Dan was so talented when you first met him?

You could tell that Dan was different the first time that you met him. He just had that certain special something that sets great musicians apart from the rest about him. He could play almost every instrument in a rock band... and not only play them all, but play them quite well too. This also goes along with very good stage presence and the ability to copy almost any artist's music.


Can you tell us some things about Dan's involvement with "The Legends?"

The Legends were originally started by Danny's brother Dave, I believe, and Dan was the keyboard player in the beginning. After several changes in personnel the group ended up being Dan on keyboards and guitar, Larry Sadler on drums and Joe Colerio on bass. I was their roadie general all around helper. At the time, back in the early 70's, The Legends were the hottest band going around the central Pa. area. Everywhere we played there were always real good crowds. The band was a GREAT copy band and then eventually started doing "original" material at which point we then came to be known as a great ORIGINAL band too.

Patrick was the attorney in charge of Dan's day-to-day business during the last 3 years of his life, and handled much of the work for his Estate's Executor for the year after his death.

I thought you might like to know a little more about Multi-Level and one or two other stories from his business life, none of which were confidential, so I thought I'd share them.

The house in your pictures is technically not the house that Dan lived in for very long. It is on the same property, and was designed by an architect hired by Dan, but the house where he lived for so long was actually taken down by him (everything but the Studio and the chimney), and what you see in the pictures was put up around the studio and the chimney. A cape colonial to a 10,000 square foot post-modern glass house.

He essentially lived in the Studio (which was originally the garage to the original house) while the old house came down and the new house went up - he seemed to enjoy the whole process. He told me that he had looked around Westport for a house to buy that was similar to the one he ultimately built, but finally decided that he couldn't leave his Studio - that it had taken him years to figure out how to get everything he wanted out of that Studio, and he didn't want to risk ending up with a brand new studio that didn't work as well.

The house wasn't quite finished when he died, but it was pretty close, and he did get to enjoy a holiday season there in good health. Dan's studio equipment was moved to California so that it could be used in conjunction with his music education foundation, which is headed by Charlie Midnight (another really nice guy with great Dan stories), Dan's writing partner, who lived in California. Dan would have loved the fact that kids were learning to produce on his equipment.

I occasionally teach copyright law classes and I often use Dan's story about how he discovered that "Love Sensation" had been sampled in Black Box's "Ride On Time" to explain how ownership issues arise in the area of sampling. "Ride On Time" came out in Europe as an Italian dance hit that had some pretty good legs. A friend of Dan's in England called him on the phone one day, saying that he had heard a song that he knew Dan would love, and that he had overnighted Dan a copy. The next day, the friend calls and says, so what do you think? Dan's response - "I think I wrote it."

It seems that Black Box hadn't bothered to ask Dan if they could sample one of the hooks from Dan's hit "Love Sensation." Since the sample was the hook for "Ride On Time" it was a pretty big "error". I suspect that Black Box never expected the song to leave Italy. After much negotiation, Dan ended up with a good percentage of that song. The other funny thing from that story is that the lyric from Love Sensation is actually "Right On Time". It seems that the Italians had misunderstood the lyric, although frankly the Ride On Time lyric makes no sense in their song either.

A final personal story - the night Dan died, I received a call from one of his employees at the time, letting me know. I went over to another lawyer's apartment for a drink that evening - to toast Dan, mostly. As I got into the cab to go home, guess what was playing on the radio, "I Can Dream About You." It still gives me goose bumps when I think about it.

A nicer (or smarter) client I've never had.

Thanks for your work on the site.

Patrick McNamara

Many thanks to Patrick for his contribution.

Editor's note: When Ride On Time was originally released in Europe the 7 and 12 inch labels did not include Dan's name on the credits. The first version used an unlicensed vocal sample from the 1980 single "Love Sensation" by Loleatta Holloway. After legal action was taken, the single was reissued with rerecorded vocals by Heather Small and Dan's name was credited on the label.

I had made arrangements to meet Dan and photograph him in Toronto when he was scheduled to do a interactive Q&A session but he was quite ill and we know the rest of the story.

In my Entertainment Photography Travels I had the good fortune of photographing many people who had worked with Dan (artistic collaboration is more like it because his talent was a gift) including: Edgar Winter, Rick Derringer, Ronnie Montrose, Neil Sedaka, Tina Turner, The members of Foghat, just to name a few.

The common denominator amongst all these people was that when I mentioned Dan Hartman's name, they all lit up in an appreciative, loving glow. They all loved the man.

I personally, loved his music and it gave me so much enjoyment.... like the Billy Joel song says "only the good die young".

All photos displayed are from Marko Shark's collection.

Far too little has been written about the Edgar Winter/Dan Hartman/James Brown connection and, since nobody else seems to be interested in doing it, allow me to put it back on the table for all of you funksters out there to take note of. I know the story. I want you to know it too. In fact, it is long overdue that someone finally takes the time and effort to re-tell it. I was there, working full-time in the music business when it all went down, and I know the story. Let me tell it to you exactly as I saw it unfold back in the 1970's through the late 1980's.

If you're a James Brown fan, you should know this story. Why? Because, in the late 1980's, it is this very connection that was responsible for delivering, to James, a very much needed “shot in the arm” comeback hit, that completely rejuvenated his (at that time) sagging and lackluster career. It is an amazing story, and it involves primarily three people: Edgar Winter, Dan Hartman, and, finally, The Godfather Of Soul.

Edgar Winter and his brother Johnny are both stars. They are both great musicians. While Johnny has taken the low road as primarily a nondescript blues player and singer, it is his three years younger brother, Edgar, who always operates with enough pomp, flash, and amazing showmanship to hold captive even the hungriest of music-starved rock audiences anywhere.

He was one of the most decent and nicest guys in the business I have ever met.. The same can be said for his long time manager, Teddy Slatus, who was always professional each and every time I had occasion to deal with him. During my stint as a locally syndicated newspaper columnist, I published feature articles on two of Edgar's bands and that was the first time I met him.

During his outdoor concert at The University Of Cincinnati's Nippert Stadium, I was asked to help with controlling part of the elaborate on stage lighting system which, indeed, was a great thrill for me. Edgar is not only a great musician and songwriter, but he is also one hell of a terrific showman. While he plays a fantastic, and very soulful saxophone, most people know Edgar as being the guy, in flowing capes (sound familiar?) who plays his signature, worn around the neck, keyboard. His massive instrumental hit “Frankenstein” has become a rock classic.

I once saw him perform when the entire arena went dark, except for Edgar's “Day Glow” painted hands which totally captivated everybody as we watched them effortlessly dance across the neck-worn keys. During the time period when Clive Davis was the head of Columbia Records, The Edgar Winter Group was headlining massive arena concerts with his new, stripped down, four-piece band.. His former, and much larger, musical organization was a Texas horn band called “Edgar Winter's White Trash” which will live on, in infamy, as being, (along with Boston's J. Geils Band, Oakland, California's Tower Of Power, and Scotland's Average White Band) one of the world's finest, but extremely rare, white boy R&B acts. If you don't believe me, get yourself a copy of their fantastic “Roadwork” album and you will become an instant believer.

Although Edgar continues, even today, working hard in both studio and live venues (he recently finished touring as a member of Ringo Starr's “All Starr Band”), it was during the height of popularity, for the The Edgar Winter Group, that the world began to take note of the tremendous talent and ability of Edgar Winter Group bassist Dan Hartman.

It was backstage, in Edgar Winter's dressing room at The University of Cincinnati's Nippert Stadium, that I met the late Dan Hartman. Dan took to music well, as a child prodigy, and was a member of his brother's rock band at the ripe old age of thirteen. He sent in a demo tape to Edgar's Blue Sky management company (later to become Blue Horizons) and, as a result, his talents were first displayed before a national audience only due to Edgar having the good sense and forethought to hire him. He was, like Paul McCartney, Prince, Bootsy Collins, and a dear friend of mine, the late Roger Troutman (of the group Zapp), one of those rare breed of musicians that could do everything. He played every instrument, knew his studio production techniques inside out, was a good singer, and wrote great songs too. In fact, the Edgar Winter Group's second largest hit “Free Ride” was penned by him before he ever even joined the group.

While he had become a member of The Edgar Winter Group in the early 1970's, he departed the band in the mid 70's, just when Disco was taking its hold. His very first recording after leaving the band, “Instant Replay,” reached Number One on the U.S. dance music charts and featured the exceptional saxophone work of Edgar himself. To put it mildly, the record was a smashing success. Few records in the entire history of what became known as “Disco” could top it. It was played, and played, and then played some more, by every dance music DJ everywhere. I cannot stress enough how much of a classic disco tune that song was and still is.

Subsequent Dan Hartman hits ensued, such as “Vertigo/Relight My Fire” (which featured the vocals of Loleatta Holloway), “Hands Down” (featuring harmonica by Stevie Wonder), “We Are The Young”, as well as the tremendously popular “I Can Dream About You” which was featured in the movie “Streets Of Fire.” In the Southwest Ohio dance market, with which I was very familiar, he scored yet again, and big, with a hugely popular dance floor favorite, I helped to promote for him here, called “Countdown.”

After achieving his immense success with “I Can Dream About You”, Hartman shifted the main focus of his career and dedicated most of his time to producing other artists--such as Tina Turner (“Simply The Best”), Joe Cocker ("Unchain My Heart"), Nona Hendryx, Loleatta Holloway, as well as writing and producing songs that were used in movies such as "Ruthless People" and "Bull Durham". He also wrote and produced an extremely popular song for the motion picture “Rocky IV”. What was it...you ask? Well.....it was a song which became the biggest-selling hit record for James Brown, in fifteen years, called “Living In America” and it also earned him a Grammy Award, for Best Male Vocalist of 1987, and, hence, we now come full circle in the Edgar Winter/Dan Hartman/James Brown connection.

Dan Hartman, like The Godfather Of Soul, himself, is no longer with us. His career, as well as his life, was tragically ended at the very young age of only 43. Don't ask me how he died. I don't like talking about it--except to say that no one...and I truly do mean no one...should be subjected to, and forced to die, that kind of death. I take off my hat to such greats as Elizabeth Taylor, Elton John, Madonna, and others, who have donated and helped raise the multi-millions of dollars necessary to fund research in an attempt to finally stop it. I miss Dan Hartman. We all will miss James Brown. But thank-you, Edgar Winter, for having the ability to see what nobody before you could see—and for bringing to the nation, and to the world, the immense talents of an extraordinary musician and producer who is sorely missed... Dan Hartman!

Many thanks to Rick Flynn for his contribution.

How I met Dan Hartman

I got into recording as a hobby. I never worked as a professional recording engineer. I love music (played the drums since I was 6) and electronics. It was a challenge which I loved, to record bands live or record them where they practiced or in my basement of my house. I didn't have fancy recording equipment. My first open reel recorder was a Lafayette Radio RT-137A recorder that my parents bought me for Christmas when I was 12 years old. After that I had bought in 1969 an Sony TC-630 and an Sony TC-252D which was just a deck. I also used Sony condenser mikes and loved the Shure 55S microphones which you can still purchase today. I built my own mike mixer, taking parts from mixers that Sony manufactured. Later in the mid 70s I bought my first 4-track/4 channel TEAC 3340S recorder which was a great recorder. 

I currently own a Yamaha 4-track/4 channel recorder and record my band with it.  I still have not joined the digital recording world.  I love the analog sound!

Being retired now, I'm taking the time to go thru reels and reels of recordings of bands of central Pennsylvania that I did from 1969 until 1983 and reprocessing them and copying to CDs. My greatest treasure are the four open reel tapes of 27 songs that Dan Hartman recorded the summer of 1971 and also tapes of his recording at Baldwin Sound Productions. I have kept the tapes until now and have given CDs of the songs to Jonathan Creaser for Dan Hartman's website.

After I graduated from high school in 1969, I started to work for AMP Inc. which is now T E Connectivity. I retired in January of 2014 from the IT department.  I started in the mailroom and that is where I met Joe Caloiero.  While working with Joe, I found that Joe was the bass player for the Legends.  I remember the Legends from playing at pool parties and fire halls and loved their music.  Joe had told me that the Legends were going to be playing at the Railroad House, (winter of 1970) which was in Marietta, Pa.  I asked Joe if I could record them live, which they had no problem me doing. I got there early that evening when they were setting up. This is when I first met Dan Hartman.

All I can say is he was so easy to work with and was down to earth. I tapped into their PA system for the vocals and I used only three mikes to record them that night. I used my Sony TC-630 open reel recorder, which had an internal amp and speakers that detached from the front. I used Koss Pro 4AA headphones for monitoring the sound and used an Sony three input mike mixer.  I used a Shure 55S mike for Dan's amp, one on Joe's bass amp and only one Sony condenser mike on Larry Sadler's drums.  I had the mikes within inches of their guitar speakers.  I remember Dan warning me that they played very loud and suggested moving the mikes way back.  I told Dan that the Shure mikes would be ok. What a show!! The challenge was the Sony TC-630 was a 2 channel/4 track recorder and you had to mix and balance everything when recording live. 

I edited the tapes at home to make a master tape that I would use to make 8-tracks and cassette tapes. I made the Legends tapes and they loved them. Dan liked my work and mix of the tapes. I recorded the Legends live at least four to five other times before Dan left to join the Edgar Winter Group in 1972. Also, the Legends came and recorded in my basement twice. 

One of those sessions I recorded "The Day the Toilet Paper Ran Out". At that time Dan was recording at Baldwin Sound Productions, Inc. in Mechanicsburg, Pa. Dan spent many long hours at that studio. He produced many groups, musicians and his own material in that studio. During the summer of 1971, Dan asked to borrow my Sony TC-630 and also my two Shure 55S mikes which Dan loved. I still have these mikes and still use them for recording the band I play in. Dan told me he was going to shack himself in a cabin and record several of his songs for demos that he was going to take to New York City. I showed Dan the sound on sound feature that the Sony recorder had and how to use the recorder.  Dan was a very fast learner. After he was done recording about 27 songs that he wrote, he brought the tapes to me and had me make copies for him and myself and also had me record selected songs on other tapes that he was taking to New York City. Two of those songs were Free Ride and My Love. Dan also gave me recordings that he also made at Baldwin's.  To this day the tapes are still in great condition.

Greg Croft

We are indebted to Greg for making his wonderful recordings available for everyone to enjoy: